Alex O’Loughlin got shipped and I landed on a soap box …….

Who would have thought that my report on slash fic writing would start with the mentioning of the character of Lori Weston. Well it does…… 😛

But before I continue with that though, I just want to explain why I am writing the report the way I am. (Invitation – Alex O’Loughlin and his shippers – Going from Bromance to Romance) I got a lot of information about slash fic writing itself, but I did not get a wide variety of actual writers responding to my invite. My aim was to find out more about the slash fiction where Alex is involved. So I am working with what I got and adding a big THANK YOU to those who did respond!

I also saw some conversations on twitter that let my thoughts take a different path to just clinically reporting back on what I found out about slash fic writing. It took me more on a general road of how we all see each other and interact because of what we believe and love.

When Lori was introduced into Hawaii-Five-0 in S2, there were a lot of comments flying around everywhere on threads surrounding the subject. I myself did not like the character, how she was introduced or the actress, but it definitely did not put me on a crusade to get rid of her.  But why start here with the Lori story?

One of the things that pissed me of the most at that time, was people saying on comment boards, that the fans that did not like Lori were all ‘these women‘ that are so in love with Alex and also so delusional about him being with any woman other than themselves, that they do not even want his character of Steve to have a relationship with a woman.They apparently don’t want to see him with a girlfriend in real life either. It is INSANE!! 🙄 Nobody I know who did not like Lori have any delusions like that (well I hope not, because most are married in any case as well :wink:). And frankly, if there are any fans like that, they might want to seek professional help. I am very serious about that.

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If you are so involved with you obsession about an actor, that you can not see him or his characters with other women or men in relationships, you might end up like some crazy person actually hating him. And even if you are breathtakingly pretty and do get to meet him one day and start a relationship with him, you are definitely not the right person for him if you think like that. He is an ACTOR. He plays roles that will include kissing and making out with other women in fake relationships. He has fans who he handles very lovingly. The woman in his life really need to be sure of herself and accept that for sure, otherwise she will have a hard time!!

Having said that, that is what I thought about the straight women shipping men and writing slash fic about them. That they are so “in love” with the actor (in this case Alex), that rather than have him ‘doing’ another woman, they write about him in love with a man, who are not competition for them as women.

I apologise for thinking that! Maybe we should all let go of that idea as the go to excuse when somebody thinks differently to us. 😀

McDanno

What do we all want out of life? Happiness, togetherness, Ohana, love and acceptance. In our Fairy-tale world the ultimate of happiness is for Prince Charming and the Princess to get through all the obstacles, kiss and live happily for ever after. I believe that in any story that we follow, we look for that connection. Each one of us look to see which couple has the potential to tell that story of eternal love. Some of us like what the writers dish up for us and go along with it, but for those who don’t, they have to ship their own happy couple.

This is me – I ship McKono. But McKono of 3-4 seasons from now. Now at this time it is just ewwwwww to me. 😮 Once WoFat is beaten and all the McGarrett secrets have been solved, when Steve is prepared to settle down and start his Hawaiian family, he and his true counterpart, Kono will find each other and live happily ever after in their own Hawaii Five-o heaven. The End.

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I do not however hate McCath for now. I love them. Michelle is such a great asset to the H5-0 team. I wish she had been there from the start as a regular. Their relationship is helping to give the new season some lighter moments and maybe some tense ones coming up soon and it is great for now. Just give her role some meat and do not let her presence take the place of the Ohana, that is my wish. 😀

And when it comes to our dearest Danno, in my eyes there is only one woman for him, Rachel. Rachel to me the most misunderstood character in the show, because the writers chose to write her the way she is – I think I hate them a little bit for that …… but it is needed to keep the story going and I have accepted that.

But Hawaii Five-0 is the brain child of the writers and producers. We are the spectators. It is their baby. In real life most of us can accept some guidance from people when raising our children, but they are ours and we all prefer to do it our own way. So let the writers be. Let them create their fantasy baby within the boundaries they are given by their network and the availability of actors and resources. We as fans however, do not have boundaries and we can create our own stories to suit our own fantasies.

I believe that, that is why there is such a need for fan fiction writing. People with writing skills and a vision for the story of the characters they choose, write and their followers read. They will also take some advice or guidance from their readers, but ultimately it is their story and they write it for themselves. When I say fanfic writers here I also include slash fic writers of course.

The biggest difference apart from the same-sex love story with fan fic and slash fic writers, is that the slash fic writers chose a pairing that will most likely never find their happiness in the story itself, because it is outside the norm of present society. They chose two very manly men that have always been straight that find a special love for each other and they write about them. This provides their stories with enough obstacles and sexual tension for them to then actually get to the they live happily ever after” part. Fan fic and slash fic writing also do not have the boundaries that family network television have of “showing” us the actually intimacy. Fiction writers can write anything from secret glances to real hardcore sex (and the readers can choose what they would like to read).

I want to share something about myself once again just to explain where my opinions come from and why slash fic is not part of my fantasy scenarios. I have quite a number of gay people in my life, male and female and most of those men are manly men.  My dearest friend is a gay man and we have known each other for more than two decades already. I am more than just his hag; we are soul mates – something like ‘Will and Grace‘ from the TV show. We have been there for each other through many relationship and the joys and heartaches that go with it.

Unfortunately I am a realist, even in my fantasy world. Some things just work in a certain way and would rarely change for me. Hence my belief that gay people normally know their orientation from an early age and although some of them try to find love in the heterosexual world, even marry and have children, they never find their true happiness until they accept themselves the way they are.

There however seems to be a small part of the population that regard themself as bi and are able to swap their sexual orientation around to fit the person that they are in love with. They look beyond the gender and they focus on the person. I think it is more commonly found amongst women than men. My gay friends also believes that there are no such thing as Bi men. For them some gay men might choose to sleep with women for some specific reason, but never for love or passion.

So in my opinion men who have been straight for 35 years of their lives and now suddenly finding love with each other as a scenario can not be ruled out, but is highly unlikely. BUT that is me and I am not going to take away anybody’s feeling or fantasy that it is possible. They might even just have always been in denial about their sexual orientation and this specific person that they love deeply, gave them the courage to admit it, who knows…..who knows and who cares, they have found love and happiness in the mind of the people who ship them. The shippers and the slash fic writer saw the potential for romance and the eternal love here and want to write it and that is their brainchild!

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Most of what I have written above, inspired the specific questions I asked the slash fic writers to answer. I wanted to get a feeling of what their experiences as far as gay people are. Also if they would just ship any character that play opposite a character played by their favorite actor. And if it is about just the sex or if it included the love story behind it for them.

What I have found is that the people who have had experience in the same-sex world, would maybe write more to help people understand that world. They want to open up people’s minds to different views that are out there in the world. Whereas for the writers that have had less close relationships with gay people, it is more about the love story and this specific romance itself.

All of the writers that responded also seems to have what they call a “one true pairing” couple that they write about. It is therefore not about gay or straight for them, but it is more about those two specific characters and what they have found with each other.

And ultimately love is at the heart of all of it: love for the show; love for the characters; love for the craft of writing itself. I write slash fiction to honour the characters I fell in love with. Besides that I find it also happens to be damn good writing practice. You take two known characters and place them in a situation that, let’s face it, isn’t ever likely to happen on the show itself, and if you want it to be believable then you have to pay closer attention to things like dialogue, characterisation, the story plotting itself, and so on. It’s not always as easy as it looks, and I enjoy that challenge.

So there you have it, the reasons I slashed two characters, and I liked it.

And I bet some of you thought all we did was write gay porn. 😉

Emerald – Mick/Josef slash fic writer

I also wanted to find out how the slash writers feel about the real actors involved in the couple that they ship. There are a lot of the shippers that do in fact also ship the actors themselves. There however seems a code of honour amongst most not to write about them, at least not publish it on open forum where everybody can read it. They keep it private amongst themself and their friends.

I can understand why there seems to be a lot more people also shipping O’Caan (the real actors) than what seemed to be the case with Alex and Jason Dohring from Moonlight. Alex and Jason were in stable heterosexual relationships during the making of Moonlight. While filming Moonlight, Jason had been married for 3 years and he still is married and welcomed his new-born girl recently. Alex and Holly made a lovely loving couple and were together for more than a year by then. Being seen at public events a lot and also privately hanging around town and traveling home to Australia a few times, always looking very much in love…..

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Maybe that gave the shippers less material to work with in regards to shipping the real actors than in the case of the two Hawaii-Five-0 men. Although Alex and Scott are both and have both been in relationships since the beginning of the making of Hawaii-Five-0, they are not often seen with their girlfriends or partners publicly and much less as lovebirds. It is not clear when Alex and Amber broke up and they were always very reluctant to share their relationship with the fans in any case, up until Alex moved to Hawaii.

Alex and Scott are seen together a lot because most of what we see of them are work related. BTS pictures, press conferences and charity events. There has also been a few paparazzi and fan photo’s of them around Hawaii. They are obviously great friends and do not hesitate to show their affection towards each other. They have stated that fact in interviews numerous times and Alex even proclaimed his ‘love‘ for Scott in one of their latest interviews. All of us however perceive their actions towards each other differently.

I see two very affectionate individuals who are very comfortable with whom they are. Whether they just can’t help it to be so affectionate towards each other because they are in love or just good mates, or if they do it deliberately to please the shipping fans, we will never know. For me Alex have always been comfortable to show physical contact with a lot of his friends. He was practically hanging on Jason during one interview they did for Moonlight. When it comes to his friends and loved ones and even fans, male or female his personal space is not very big. So for me it is not surprising that he would show the same kind of physical affection to his fellow actor and friend. Therefor I do not experience his physical affection towards Scott as anything new or out of the ordinary.

So to summarise this very long story of mine:

  • We all love Alex as an actor and his different roles.
  • We want to see him and his characters happy.
  • If the story does not provide satisfaction to our fantasy, we ship.
  • Some of us write about the characters we ship.
  • Some of these stories also take us to the heights of passion.

Every one of us form part of the bigger fandom surrounding Alex and his work. Best thing we can do to support his career is to take hands and share that love for him. My best friends in the fandom laugh at me shipping McKono, but that does not make us enemies. Some of us like the Bromance, others see the Romance …… and in the end it is about the show and the characters we love!!

A special thanks to Emerald for suggesting that I look further into the work and lives of the slash writers and for sharing her own experience. Also thank you for all the reading material on the subject that you provided. You can find more or Emerald’s thoughts and also links to subjects regarding slash fic writing in the comments on the original invite page to the slash writers here.

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42 Comments

Filed under Alex O´Loughlin, Hawaii Five-0, Intense Research Reports, Moonlight

42 responses to “Alex O’Loughlin got shipped and I landed on a soap box …….

  1. I personally don’t get the whole concept. I adore Alex and I am so happy he is with Malia and their 2 children from previous relationships and the new addition of their baby boy. He has been out and about with Malia since November 2011 I think because he feels safe and comfortable in his new adopted home in Hawaii. I as a red blooded female of course love Alex because he is as gorgeous on the inside as the outside. I love the hard work he puts in to make his character come to life off the screen. I adore the McRoll relationship because I can live vicariously through Cath. What they do is called acting and tv life is fictional. I have a problem wrapping my head around people being so vicious toward Malia because she is with Alex, I also have a problem with people being vicious toward Cath because she is with McGarrett. Some people may hate me for saying this but I think a good reality check is needed for people who have a problem seeing Alex or his character Steve with anyone but themselves. Thank you Paula for this great article. After saying all this I still feel everyone is entitled to their own opinion even if I don’t agree with them or they with me.

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    • FOYeur

      Hi Wanda
      I am sorry if everything I wrote did not help you understand the concept better. People find different relationships than what is written in the show to be more to their liking.
      Maybe I should have emphasize more that this was a report on slash fic writing of mainly McDanno and Mick/Josef. I do not want to open up the conversation about Alex’s present real life relationship at all. Any and all comments in regards to that will be moderated.
      You might like what you see in his relationship and others might see it differently. I want us all to respect that…..
      That was the main aim of what I wrote
      oxox
      FOYeur

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      • No I understand and that is why I said at the bottom that everyone was entitled to their own opinions I should have said I respected every opinion even if it wasn’t like mine. I loved the article . Please feel free to delete my previous post, I understand now but I can’t find a way to delete it. xoxo

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        • FOYeur

          Hi Wanda, it is all perfectly okay and I do not want to delete it.
          We are all entitled to our opinions as you say and I just don’t want this to be a ground for everybody to start slinging mud. That will defy the whole object of what I was trying to write here. 🙂

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        • Your comments are fine, don´t worry 🙂 I have full confidence in our followers for being understanding and respecting different opinions.

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    • lucy

      I agree with Wanda 100%.Love the man and glad he is happy!!!

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    • FOYeur

      Hi Wanda
      I just want to make sure that everybody understand that we do love everybody’s opinions and comments very much. I am sure most people that have ever commented on here can tell you that and that we respond favorably to most.
      I do not however handle speculation on subjects on public forum very well. Anybody that have read my fangirl story will know that I like to deal in facts and not rumours.
      Real life relationships of actors and the discussion about it rests on rumour and speculation and how everybody perceive what they see. A smile from Alex that look happy to you, but might look like a fake grin for me…..it is all in the eye of the beholder for each ones own interpretation.

      Alex is a gorgeous sweetheart and a brilliant actor, with many faults and shortcomings. And we just want people to enjoy him with us, warts and all. 🙂

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    • Emerald

      Do you think it’s possible that you don’t get the concept of fan fiction, and slash fiction in particular, because you’re seeing Alex as his character(s) and not the character(s) themselves? You see I don’t write with Alex in mind, at all. I’m also not attracted to Alex from a physical standpoint, so it’s not like I’m writing one of his characters with another man, because I can’t stand for Alex to be happy with anyone but me, and that includes seeing him on screen playing opposite female characters.

      Alex doesn’t exist in my work. I write about a fictional character, who isn’t even real, and that’s as far as it goes. This isn’t about Alex, or even Alex the actor playing a character on screen. For me it’s about the character, period.

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  2. karin@notmcnerd

    Very interesting insight and comments, FOYeur. You evidently put a lot of thought (and work) into this post. Thank you.
    I have read a few pieces of slash fic I happened to come across online. Like any fiction, they are the product of someone’s imagination. Readers either like it or they don’t. I do not have a problem with it, but don’t actively seek it out.

    As far as fans being obsessed with Alex and the characters he plays, I think we FUCUPs are as obsessed as anyone. I don’t find it unhealthy because we willingly, lovingly, and laughingly share that crazyness with each other. You help with that.
    BTW, I love the title of this post.

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    • FOYeur

      Thanks Karin
      Actually most of what I wrote came from long conversations I had with one of the writers. Things she said and answers I gave her, gave me most of what I wrote.
      I also like her writing and have read some of it before we even started chating. I find her a lovely person and a new friend at the end of it all….

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      • Emerald

        Aww, that’s so awesome that you met someone through this, and she’s become a friend and someone who’s writing you enjoy. Was it one of the H50 writers I sent your way? If it was, I think I know who it is, and yes she is an absolute sweetheart 😀

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    • You are so right about sharing our crazy obsessiveness makes it more acceptable for us when we have a good laugh about it all. I will though admit being slightly jealous of sharing Alex with his ladies, but then again we haven´t met yet…it can be me one day 😉

      PS this is again some seriously good writing from Foyeur, you have some good grey matter between your ears partner 😀

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    • FOYeur

      Karin I agree we are definitely obsessed, otherwise we would not be doing what we are doing. But we do make a lot of fun about ourselves and it and him, because we are not delusional about the nature of it.
      The line of all of us that would “do” him in a heartbeat if we ever got the chance is very long. 😀 but we are not ‘jealous’ & hating anybody else in the line or those fake “doing” him onscreen or really “doing” him…..

      And thanks for “getting” the title.
      As you know I think long and hard about titles – as with my name FOYeur 😛

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  3. Mary Jane

    Thoughtful writing, Foyeur. I’d be interested in the number of people who appreciate slashfic who are normally straight. Heterosexual guys often like the idea of two gorgeous girls together, maybe this is similar.

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    • FOYeur

      Hi MJ
      I think in one of the links that are mentioned on the original invite page, somebody actually talks about this. I had such a lot of stuff to read through, I can’t remember which one it was now……
      If I remember correctly they think it had more to do that with the two guys together the partnership is more equil.
      The writers can give the boys a more emotional side with more affection than how men are normally perseved
      And the writer also have the marionette strings in her hand to make them do what she wants and would like…..

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    • Emerald

      There’s a common misconception that all slash writers are straight women, and whilst that is true in many cases, if you spend enough time in the slash community you’ll find that us slashers run the gamut of both sexual orientation and gender identity. I personally know slash writers who are heterosexual, bisexual (both men and women), pansexual, gay, lesbian, female to male transgender, male to female transgender, and gender queer. I’ve even known a couple of people who identified as heterosexual nearly all their lives, until they finally came out as other than straight, mostly through their contact with the slash community.

      Unfortunately, in my experience, at least some of the ‘slash writers are all straight women’ attitudes does come from the gay community dismissing people who don’t fit into the gay/straight binary. Bisexual slash writers, for example, are therefore lumped in with straight slash writers, because we’re magical unicorns that don’t actually exist, so instead we get misidentified as straight, or not having made up our minds yet to be gay.

      In the words of a very apt saying, by persons unknown – “No, you’re confused, I’m bisexual” 😉

      Having said all of the above, I will say that, in general, yes many slash writers do identify as heterosexual women.

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      • FOYeur

        Thanks Emerald
        I depend on you to provide general knowledge about slash fic writing as I haven’t even touched the surface of what it is all about, as my interest to the subject mainly lies with Alex and his characters.
        The responds I got from the McDanno community was rather small and I presume they do not see our little corner here on ‘Intense Study’ as worthy of their time and effort. I understand it and do not blame them for it. 🙂
        The feeling I do however get is that the Mick/Josef scene was more open to the gay community, whereas the McDanno shipping and slash fic writers are more part of the heterosexual female community……my perception could be wrong….

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        • Emerald

          No your perception in general is correct, the Moonlight slash fandom does tend to be more of a lovely little rainbow community. There are a couple of straight fans who write on the odd occasion, but even they would classify themselves as ‘straight allys’ to the LGBT community. 🙂

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  4. I applaud your attempt to understand the concept, because I’ve tried as well and as I’m sure you’re aware, there hasn’t been much research on this subject. I’m afraid I still don’t comprehend it because many of the slash lovers I meet online are hetero females who ONLY like male-on-male stories. At first I was very dismissive of their particular tastes, but I’ve learned that some great people dig this stuff. I still don’t get why, and it’s definitely not my cup-of-tea, but it takes all kinds to make the world go round.

    One thing I feel I have to clarify though: regarding the “Lori” lash-back, it began before it was even known who was being cast in the role. Before people saw how the character was being introduced or how Lauren German handled the role. Having met some of the more fervent Alex O’Loughlin fans online when I happened upon a fansite a few years ago, I know for a fact that there are a lot of women out there who were extremely unhappy prior to season 1 when it was announced that McGarrett would have a love interest. I repeatedly saw “I don’t want to see him with any woman” tweets and posts on sites and Facebook. Then BEFORE season 2 even started, the anti-Lori campaigns began. What I found interesting this time, was in addition to some of the “I can’t stand to see Alex with a woman other than Beth or myself,” group, was the extreme reaction from some of the slash fans. Now, I want to be clear that I’m not saying most slash fans had this reaction, but there was an very vocal group who did. So, observing that there are people who can’t stand to see Alex with a woman (or McGarrett with a woman) isn’t “INSANE.” What’s insane is that there are people who actually feel that way.

    Back to the concept of “slash” though – I do see shippers who for whatever their personal reason sense an affinity between two characters regardless of gender, but I’m still puzzled by the heterosexual females who ONLY seem to ship homosexual male relationships. I’ll be curious to see if any more explanations are forthcoming, because I do find this interesting.

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    • FOYeur

      Hi Terry
      I agree with you totally on the matter that people make those kind of comments about the love interest….
      Yes for me those comments were INSANE and right under that I do say that people who really feel that way need professional help. So I do in strong words address the matter of those people right under my comment about the comments!!
      I do not like to be seen in the same catagory as them just because I have an opinion about the character I do not like….That is why I call it INSANE.

      I did not report on everything I read because what I got was more about writing slash fic in general than what I wanted spesifically about Alex. There is a lot of interesting reading material in regards to this on the links that I mention on the original page….
      Maybe I will have the time for a more clinical report on the slash fic in general for another post.
      Fact is, I wanted to write more about Alex and slash fic that spesifically involve him, because that is what our blog is about, than to go on a crusade for slash fic itself 🙂

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    • Emerald

      Unfortunately the issue of slashers hating on female love interests for the characters they ship, is a problem in the slash community, and it is one that many of us do try and fight against. To give an example, I was originally interested in becoming involved with the H50 slash community, until I very quickly realised that not only did I just not see the pairing myself, I also found the community in general was far more open to shipping the actors themselves (something that is generally considered very taboo among the Moonlight writers). The final straw, for me, came when I stumbled across a story written just after the introduction of Catherine to the series, where the writer had Catherine tortured and then slow roasted to death over a fire – and they had the audacity to claim it was all just a joke, because Catherine was getting in the way of McDanno. I’m sorry, but I don’t find anything funny about a woman being murdered in such a horrific way. Now maybe if the story had been marked as horror, or dark!fic, then it would be different, but not ‘LOL Catherine’s gonna be burnt to death’. At that point I was out of there so fast I don’t think my feet even hit the ground.

      Let me put it this way, I write Mick/Josef, writing Mick/Josef it’s important to me that I try to get their characterisations right (or as right as I can). Mick loves Beth, and at some point he also loved, perhaps still loves, Coraline. If I was to write a story where Mick did nothing but go on about what a b*tch Beth or Coraline was, how much he hated them, wanted them dead, etc etc, then not only would I be acting very like a total misogynist, I’d also be writing Mick very much out of character.

      It is possible to write slash fiction whilst still acknowledging, and respecting, the feelings, or love that the respective characters had for their female partners. Of course you can take the easy way out and have said female partner die in a tragic accident (which I’ve done, complete with Mick suitably mourning the death of someone he cared so deeply for), but there are numerous other ways you can handle the issue instead of turning the female character into some sort of hated harpie, or, stars forbid, torturing them to death over a slow roasting fire.

      I must say as well, the best, most respectful H50 slash writers I’ve met are the ones who have tended to form their own little personal communities, and who aren’t necessarily involved with the H50 slash fandom at large.

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      • FOYeur

        The feeling I got from the people that did respond and also reading some of their stories gave me the idea that they do like their own pairing but I haven’t experienced that kind of hatred for the female characters of the show.
        If what you say is true, it does sound desturbing to me.
        If you love a character how can you hate someone that at some time meant something to them, so much that you want to torture them to death……..

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        • Emerald

          It’s not something that’s limited to the slash community, In the early days of the Moonlight fandom, the character of Coraline copped an incredible amount of hatred. Fans who shipped Mick and Coraline over Mick & Beth found themselves being stalked online, receiving a constant barrage of abuse, having threatening emails sent to them. One fan in particular was told that her shipping Mick and Coraline meant she was hating and disrespecting women (but bashing a female character is totes okay – yeah I could never work that one out either).

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          • FOYeur

            😆 Good thing then I did not add my preferences for the Moonlight couples here…..I have lots of “sympathy” for Coraline……

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  5. Emerald

    “Hence my belief that gay people normally know their orientation from an early age and although some of them try to find love in the heterosexual world, even marry and have children, they never find their true happiness until they except themselves the way they are.

    There however seems to be a small part of the population that are able to swap their sexual orientation around to fit the person that they are in love with. They look beyond the gender and they focus on the person. I think it is more commonly found amongst women than men.

    Just in regards to this particular sesction. There tends to be two schools of thought in the slash community in regards to ostensibly heterosexual characters being written as same sex attracted – WNGWJLEO (We’re not gay, we just love each other), and the idea that unless a character comes straight out and says ‘I am heterosexual’, the fact that they’re seen dating, or having relationships with women on screen, doesn’t discount the possibility they could be bisexual. The ‘We’re not gay, we just love each other’ side of things has fallen out of favour in recent years, some people think of it as a form of bisexual erasure. But there is also a belief that those types of stories, the ones where the love the characters have for one another is so great it can override sexual identity, are the pinnacle of romantic idealism for some fans. I will admit I kind of straddle both fences (no pun on my own sexuality intended). I like, and read, both kinds of stories.

    In my own writing, I believe I’ve written one story where Mick was bisexual before he met Josef, but for the most part I’ve tended to go with the idea of ‘we don’t need a label to define what we have with one another’. I suppose for me that’s a bit of the idealist coming out. Writing vampire characters I do subscribe to the idea that ‘Vampires are outside the realms of human constructed notions of sexuality’, but I also like the idea that one day we’ll all just love who we love, and no one will bat an eyelid. There’ll be no need for labels like gay, straight, bi, pan, queer, etc, because love really will just be love. Like I said, that’s the idealist coming out in me, the realist accepts that this isn’t the way things are at the moment, so I do very openly and proudly claim the label of bisexual/queer.

    And speaking of bisexuality, I agree with what you said about knowing your sexual orientation from an early age and not being truly happy until you accept yourself the way you are. I knew I had feelings for boys and girls from a very early age. I think I was 6 when I first started having innocent, childish crushes on both male and female celebrities. Growing up I continued to have crushes on female teachers, my female friends (I’d walk around the school yard with my arm around them like we were a couple, and think nothing of it, until they’d have to politely tell me to please not do that, because I was making them uncomfortable) as well as plenty of boys in my school as well. In high school girls who were thought to like other girls were referred to as ‘lemons’. There was one girl who earned the nickname, because she’d always sit on other girl’s laps as a joke. I think I was the only one who actually encouraged her to do so, and never minded when she sat on mine. Then again I was also madly in teenage love with some of my male teachers and quite a few boys in my class.

    Confused? Yes as a matter of fact I was. I had no idea such a thing as bisexuality even existed. I knew I was having romantic, and later, sexual feelings for both genders, but I definitely couldn’t be a lesbian, so surely this must all just have been a silly childhood/teenage phase (the main reason I assumed I wasn’t a lesbian, apart from liking boys too, was the fact that I’d been raised in a very homophobic household, and actually believed, because that’s the way I’d been taught, that lesbian couples always consisted of one who played the female and one ‘butch’ lesbian who played the male of the relationship – I was a feminine woman, attracted to other feminine women, therefore I was definitely, 100% not a lesbian, because if I had been I would have been attracted to butch women who looked more like men – yeah, I know, I can see how ridiculous that thought process was in hindsight).

    Anyway, I spent several months trying to tell myself I was gay, despite my mostly wrong beliefs about what being gay meant, and I was miserable, because it felt like I was lying to myself. Then I tried to tell myself I was straight, and going through a phase, and I still felt miserable, because it still felt like I was living a lie and trying to force myself into being something I wasn’t. Then, when I was 19, I met and became good friends with a girl I worked with at the time. We went out for drinks one night, and she revealed she was bisexual. The more she spoke out what her bisexuality meant, the more I began to realise ‘Oh my god she’s talking about me, this is who I am, I’m bisexual too’. The sense of relief was palpable, finally I knew who I was, I wasn’t going through a phase, I wasn’t confused – I was bisexual. I came out privately to myself, and to her, that same night, and publicly a year later.

    The thing with bisexuality though, I don’t swap and change my orientation to fit the gender of the person I’m having a relationship with. Just because I’m married to a man now, doesn’t mean I’ve changed my orientation to straight, I’m still bisexual. And when I was with my ex girlfriend, I wasn’t suddenly now a lesbian for the time we were together, I was still bisexual. I am bisexual whether I’m single, or in a relationship, and regardless of who I’m dating. Being bisexual, to me, means I acknowledge an ability to be romantically, emotionally, and physically attracted to a person regardless of gender or gender identity, and to desire, and form a committed relationship with that person. I feel that way no matter who I’m dating, or as the case is now, married to.

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    • FOYeur

      Sorry, my wording might have been a bit clumsy there describing the orientation of bisexual people.
      What you wrote here is what I meant…….you love who you are with because you are bi and not one or the other at the time.
      But I think you will agree with me that it is a small part of the population that are truly bisexual and maybe therefor also why it was so difficult for you to identify it, because even in the gay community it is not widely recognised.

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      • Emerald

        Oh yeah, believe me I’ve come across plenty ‘faux bisexuals’ in my time. I’m sure you know the type I’m talking about – you’re out at a club, they catch your eye, the flirt, you flirt back, you get chatting, you end up dancing close together, maybe a bit of kissing and wandering hands if you’re lucky. And then just as you’re thinking ‘I need to ask this girl for her number, I really hope we can see one another again, like soon’, and planning out the first date in your head ‘ Dinner? Too presumptuous, should we just start off with something a little less angling towards a relationship? What about Coffee, coffee’s good, maybe grab a bit to eat if she wants as well’, it hits you that she’s not really interested, you’re just being used to make her look trendy/turn the guys in the room on/make her boyfriend jealous/hot/whatever the f*ck else/ etc etc.

        On the other hand I’ve also had a gay friend who after much soul searching and lengthy discussions, came to the realisation that he was actually bisexual and the only reason he’d identified as gay is because everyone he’d ever known had told him he had to pick a side – you’re a man who likes dick, you’re gay, end of story, When he tried to come out to his gay friends as bisexual, he experienced such a backlash (he actually lost quite a few friends) that he ended up going back to identifying as gay in public, and just privately acknowledging that he is actually bisexual to himself, and among a small number of friends he knows he can trust to be supportive.

        Unfortunately the ‘male bisexuals don’t exist’ attitude in the gay community is one that is a common one. Things are slowly improving, and there is a bit more acceptance now than say 10 years ago, but even so, it does kind of suck to be told your sexual orientation is wrong, or it doesn’t exist, or you should just be able to wake up one day and decide you’re really gay. I mean how would anyone who was gay feel if someone came up to them and said ‘I don’t believe in homosexuality, what you’re identifying as is wrong, you should wake up tomorrow and make the decision that you’re going to be straight’. Just personally I don’t think they’d be too impressed, to put it mildly. That’s not aimed at you, by the way, Foyeur, I’m just talking in general. The ‘bisexuals don’t exist’ spiel is a bit of a sticking point with me, and the ‘bisexual men don’t exist’ spiel even more so.

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        • FOYeur

          Oh I am fine with it…..I purely go on what my gay friends tells me. I would not know about any of it myself.
          I have found in life the nearly everybody feels that if people do not feel.like they feel, they are only in denial – I think it is because people can’t believe that others can have a different feeling to them….. 🙂

          Fact is, if you have sexual & romanic interest in people of both sexes as you, you will know that early on in life and it won’t suddenly pop up just because of one person…….so I still believe that two guys that have always been and acted straight for more than 3 decades, won’t just now suddenly for the first time feel attacted to somebody of the same sex as well. just because they are so great together.
          I do not believe everybody should feel like me on it and as I have said in the report, just because that does not work for my fantasy world, I do not want to take that away from somebody for who it does work.
          Maybe the romantic in me is just dead to believe in that one true great love that defies everything you have ever known or believed about youself 😉

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          • Emerald

            “Maybe the romantic in me is just dead to believe in that one true great love that defies everything you have ever known or believed about youself ”

            In regards to slash fiction in particular, I think a lot of it comes down to the skill of the writer as to whether or not a scenario like that can be believable. I’ve read some stories that had me absolutely believing, 100%, that yes these two men who have been heterosexual their whole lives really have just fallen in love with someone of the same sex, despite never having had a single same sex attracted thought or idea prior to this relationship, ever (a good slash writer can craft an entire relationship out of the single raise of an eyebrow, and make you believe it ;)). On the other hand I’ve also read WNGWJLEO (We’re not gay, we just love each other) type stories that have been little more than a poorly thought out excuse to shove two characters into a relationship, because ‘Yay, two hot men having sexy fun times’.

            Speaking from personal experience, I did know one guy who’s own relationship with his boyfriend almost completely mirrored the slash fiction trope of ‘We’re not gay, we just love each other’. He had been heterosexual all his life, totally into women, physically, sexually romantically, etc, absolutely zero attraction to men (and not ‘secretly he really was, but he was too deep in denial to accept it’), the thought of ever having any sort of sexual or romantic experience with a man just didn’t even cross his mind. It wasn’t like he had to question whether he was straight, he just was.

            And then when he was in his middle-ish twenties (around 23/24) he met, and fell in love with a guy who ended up becoming his long term boyfriend, and later husband. They got a nice little place, and moved in together, performed their own, private, commitment ceremony, exchanged rings, and from that day on, as far as they were concerned, they were married (still are, as far as I know).

            But the thing is, this guy was still very much attracted to women, and he still felt like he identified as heterosexual because he had no romantic or sexual desires towards men at all, except for one. It wasn’t something he was looking for – being in a committed relationship with another man just wasn’t something he ever thought about, or even imagined for himself – he’d never felt even the slightest inkling of being into guys the same way he was into women, and yet he met this one guy and *boom* that was it, he fell head over heels in love.

            So yeah, I do believe it is extremely rare (he is literally the only guy I have ever known who this has happened to), but I also know that it can happen. So I guess maybe for me that makes it easier to read stories where two men who have been nothing but heterosexual for 3 decades or more, suddenly find each other, and fall in love, and for that not to seem completely unrealistic (but again, like I said earlier, that also depends a lot on the skill of the person writing the story as well).

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            • FOYeur

              Emerald I agree with you that the writers skill will make it believable and don’t get me wrong…..most of the slash fic I read was wonderfully believable. The romance and the reasoning for the attraction and the passion is all there and good. It is not that I did not like the stories.
              I myself just don’t ship the characters.

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  6. FOYeur and responders…. writing on the of subject slash writers has another way to approach the love of Alex O’Loughlin.

    I look at him as an actor who sometimes fills my needs with his ability to bring me into the story. Except from a bad story line and acting (stiff) and other factors, keep me within his persona.

    I don’t need him to take his shirt or pants off. I’m a fan of other artist, but there lack of clothing is not part of my interest to the actor. My love is with the story line, and the performerance. Sexually performed with any members of the team is find. Kono and Adam scene in the shower was find, I don’t need to see the act of se/ to enjoy the scene. I have an imagination.

    I’m not a story writer, but finding this site has introduce me to great writers.

    The Lori Weston termination in season two, was due to fans , and TPTB. Economically money is needed to support yourself. Lori is not homeless, but for some women fans this was a glorious day. Sad……

    Wonderful writing by all…Great subject….

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  7. Since I haven’t yet ventured into M/M writing, I’ll weigh in as a reader. I said before that as far as Alex’s characters go, I only like the Mick/Josef slash. I just can’t picture Steve and Danno together for some reason. The only thing I can think is that I’m not very attracted to Scott, so without that, I can’t enjoy thinking of the character that way. (Sorry to all who love Scott. No disrespect to the man intended. I think he’s a great actor, just not the type of guy I find attractive.)

    That said, if I was attracted to Scott, I’d totally ship McDanno. But, I also ship McKono and I will enjoy every scene with Steve and Cath. And as much as I didn’t like the character, I would have enjoyed a hot scene between Lori and Steve if there’d been one.

    Again, before I said it has to stay between the characters. I wouldn’t read or write anything based on real life–not just with Alex, but anyone. To me that’s crossing the line. (Not that I don’t have a few fantasies involving me with Alex, but I think most of us have those.)

    I’ve written Moonlight fanfic, including one very hot sex scene for Mick and Beth, but would love to some day write some Mick/Josef stories.

    I not only enjoy reading Mick/Josef slash, but I like to read M/M erotic stories, M/M romance stories, etc. I am one of “those women” who are like the men who enjoy the thought of two women together. I like to see or read about two men together. Heck, throw in a woman so I can live vicariously through her, and it’s a really great story. I am almost afraid to admit all this because I don’t want people to think I only want to see or read porn. I’m still a woman–and a romance writer–so it still has to be emotional.

    I will admit that as a straight woman–with the way society is and with what we’re taught–it was a transition process for me to start enjoying men together. But let me tell you, there is some amazing writing out there, and the Mick/Josef slash was my first taste. I’m so thankful to this community of writers–Emerald being the first I read–for opening my mind.

    I also think, at least for me, the reason Mick/Josef works is the vampire sexuality thing. This may be another reason I can’t get into McDanno. Who knows. That was all my two cents, at least. If it was even worth that much.

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    • FOYeur

      Lorraine, your oppinion is always worth it.
      Vampires are hot and different creatures…..and maybe if you live sooooo long new options of exploring sex is the way to go 😉
      There was always this tention between Mick & Josef, from the very first scene of them together

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  8. hunny_bee1

    FOYeur, I read your blog all the the time and I love it. However, this particular post has probably made me your fan for life, basically because you are – like myself – a McKono shipper! I’ve been rooting for these two since early in season 1 but, like you, I’m prepared to be patient and live in hope that it could happen in a few seasons’ time. These two are SO meant to be (can you imagine the cute little Hawaiian babies they would have?!). Unfortunately, with Adam & Cath hanging around, it seems it’s going to be a very long wait indeed…

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    • FOYeur

      Hunny_bee, for me the wait is good. I would actually hate them together now, because it is not their time yet!
      Sometimes you first have to be with the wrong person to appreciate the right one. 😀
      They are Mr & Mrs Right…..just not Mr & Mrs right now!
      For now Cath & Adam is great to me…..

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  9. LaHagela (The Tinkler)

    Having grown up in a notoriously gay community on Long Island, and having spent many many summers at friends beach houses in the awesome LGBT community of Cherry Grove on Fire Island, I have many friends who are gay, lesbian, transgender, and M/F transexuals.
    Even with this history and having read your research, I still find it hard to understand when straight women write m/m slash fic. For some reason it just doesn’t add up in my head. I’m in no way saying it’s wrong, deviant or anything else. I just can’t wrap my head around it personally. Which in the grand scheme of things doesn’t matter to the writers, as I am obviously not part of their target audience.
    Nice work on the write up FOYeur!

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  10. Pingback: Alex O’Loughlin and his shippers – Going from Bromance to Romance | Alex O´Loughlin ~ An Intense Study

  11. I’ve been lurking around this site since I started watching Hawaii Five-0 around the mid to late September but never commented before. This was a really interesting post and I always enjoy reading the comments as much/more than the actual article. This time was no exception. I write fic myself, but a rule of mine is that I only do canon pairings, but H50 is breaking that rule. I halfway to 80% ship McDanno, even when not trying to ship them. Also, I am Asexual female, but for a long time thought I was straight, because of the misconception that asexuals have zero sexual attraction to others, when they can actually have ‘low’ attraction. 🙂 Also, sorry if I’m kind of rambling and my thoughts don’t contribute much to anything.

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    • Jump right in with the comments when you feel like it. We of course drool over Alex on this blog, and I have very rudely chopped off Danny from most of the pics. I think it might not aid the McDanno fic writing. Hope you still enjoy what we are serving 🙂

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  12. Oh, I like each of the characters/actors as individuals as well, that’s why I lurk around here from time to time lol. Google images keeps directing me here. 🙂

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  13. Brenda V

    I’m very thankful for all the slash writers. I have read mostly all of Emerald’s “Josef/Mick” stories and really enjoyed it. The chemistry between the actors playing the mentioned roles made this ship seem like a match made in heaven! 😋

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